tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post5164062780367290958..comments2023-06-20T02:25:36.578-07:00Comments on The Scholar's Stage: The Framers and the Framed: Notes On the Slate Star Codex ControversyT. Greerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04621529800248145193noreply@blogger.comBlogger25125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-65705722166984338602021-03-03T06:32:03.330-08:002021-03-03T06:32:03.330-08:00The claim that SSC is a den of rationalists is eas...The claim that SSC is a den of rationalists is easily disproved by the SSC survey, which shows that only 13% of readers consider themselves such. However, I also disagree with the claim that this is some sort of religious community. I would argue that it's simply a community of similar people, like so many exist, where that similarity is being hypersystematizing (which refers to the Aapjenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-48448473858921320502021-02-28T06:48:29.851-08:002021-02-28T06:48:29.851-08:00This is a brilliant piece. I think it presents a v...This is a brilliant piece. I think it presents a very reasonable take on the whole issue. While I wouldn't call myself a rationalist anymore the concepts and community provided by HPMOR and SSC helped me to think about how I think at a time where I deeply needed it. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-56732530084577807522021-02-27T18:51:42.487-08:002021-02-27T18:51:42.487-08:00Adopted from a discussion elsewhere on the interne...Adopted from a discussion elsewhere on the internet to fit within 4k characters:<br /><br />This article is fantastically well written and asks the right questions, which are double successes that most other articles on this topic have failed to meet. I will be reading more of your stuff. Nonetheless I have one central criticism.<br /><br />***<br /><br />You argue that the NYT has a GodWithAShotgunnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-14977178847156486622021-02-27T12:17:01.666-08:002021-02-27T12:17:01.666-08:00This is by far the best take on the whole ssc deba...This is by far the best take on the whole ssc debacle I've read. Up to this point, I'd been pretty certain that it was some sort message that the Times won't give in to demands.<br /><br />On the topic of AI risk, it's unfortunate that the loudest voices are the most absurd. For a more sober analysis of the risks involved in the current ML trajectory, see [human compatible](https:David Weberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14777068118462203735noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-2151644734922911102021-02-27T11:41:41.434-08:002021-02-27T11:41:41.434-08:00Sebastian--
My apologies, I have fixed it now.
...Sebastian-- <br /><br />My apologies, I have fixed it now.<br /><br />@Anon February 26, 2021 at 2:38 AM<br /><br />"by first deciding what they're going to write and only then doing such research as they feel they have to." <br /><br />Hit job implies per-meditated malice. I doubt there was any here. In any case, the story they decied they were going to write wasn't "slateT. Greerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04621529800248145193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-88302825465124628722021-02-27T11:33:55.704-08:002021-02-27T11:33:55.704-08:00"I don't want to play six degrees of Kevi..."I don't want to play six degrees of Kevin Bacon here, but "I am not a member of Grey Tribe" is incorrect. Using combinatorial networks based on who follows you and who you used to follow, you're about 1 step from Slatestarcodex."<br /><br />I think it is fair to say that my readership overlaps with SSC quite a bit -- when I asked my readers in *my* annual user survey T. Greerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04621529800248145193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-16720307018729222542021-02-27T09:21:35.836-08:002021-02-27T09:21:35.836-08:00Thank you for the generous comments about my post ...Thank you for the generous comments about my post on this topic. I think you're on point as well!<br /><br />I agree the oddest thing about the rationalists is the AI X-risk thing.<br /><br />I think you make a good point about limiting the use of the word "violence". There's definitely a good case for that. It was an asymmetric act of power.<br /><br />You have misspelled my Sebastian Benthallhttps://digifesto.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-15739921826016740782021-02-27T06:38:32.500-08:002021-02-27T06:38:32.500-08:00I don't want to play six degrees of Kevin Baco...I don't want to play six degrees of Kevin Bacon here, but "I am not a member of Grey Tribe" is incorrect. Using combinatorial networks based on who follows you and who you used to follow, you're about 1 step from Slatestarcodex.<br /><br />You're allowed to define yourself all you want, but there's a network of writers and people who read them on the internet who are Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03012105106969499237noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-32336052686766216322021-02-27T06:31:00.331-08:002021-02-27T06:31:00.331-08:00"Has the time come to overthrow old “East Coa..."Has the time come to overthrow old “East Coast” hierarchies and replace them with new “West Coast” institutions?"<br /><br />The time has come to replace old west coast institutions with new Beijing institutions hahaha. Google --> Bytedance. Stanford --> Tsinghua. hahaha i hope u enjoy blogging from your parent's basement. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-53135569857606197182021-02-26T09:17:55.884-08:002021-02-26T09:17:55.884-08:00I agree with many of your points, but one needs cl...I agree with many of your points, but one needs clarification:<br /><br />The New York Times did not out Scott Alexander. It did not dox him. The only person claiming that it even threatened to dox him was Scott. And he later revised that to: the reporter could not promise not to reveal my name. <br /><br />In any case, 8 months passed after Scott made that claim. And then he published his name Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-5603546523571892412021-02-26T05:36:49.795-08:002021-02-26T05:36:49.795-08:00That Sandifer article is quite good; thank you for...That Sandifer article is quite good; thank you for linking to it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-53159825118161983692021-02-26T05:07:48.125-08:002021-02-26T05:07:48.125-08:00Typo correction: "Cade Metz’s Time article&qu...Typo correction: "Cade Metz’s Time article" -> "Cade Metz’s Times article"Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-59672098765583866882021-02-26T04:09:29.850-08:002021-02-26T04:09:29.850-08:00"How did that not make it into the article wh..."How did that not make it into the article while all this nonsense about the Silicon Valley psyche did?"<br /><br />You ask the above about AI risk, and I think it is best answered by the fact that Cade Metz, the reporter in question, has a book out about that very topic: "Genius Makers: The Mavericks Who Brought AI to Google, Facebook, and the World".<br /><br />To quote fromAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-88387191297467976802021-02-26T02:38:09.901-08:002021-02-26T02:38:09.901-08:00I don't understand your answer to "Was it...I don't understand your answer to "Was it a premeditated “hit job” or revenge piece?"<br /><br />You answer this very strongly in the negative. ("all the talk about “hit jobs” is silly and conspiratorial.") But then you go on to say that the New York Times approaches all its stories, presumably including this one, by first deciding what they're going to write and only Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-33453188533778094632021-02-26T02:28:26.090-08:002021-02-26T02:28:26.090-08:00The question of whether it was a "hit piece&q...The question of whether it was a "hit piece" is another one where it's useful to break it down into even more specific questions, because it feels like people are using it as a stand-in for other issues and talking past each other.<br /><br />Like, there's simple advice that someone might give: Don't cross the New York Times, because if you do they'll trash you in their Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-1273594679018211962021-02-26T00:01:04.036-08:002021-02-26T00:01:04.036-08:00(continued)He admits that his proposal is "on...(continued)He <a href="https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/a-modest-proposal-for-republicans#comment-1359573" rel="nofollow">admits</a> that his proposal is "<i>on the border between "true" and "much more complicated than that but framed in a way that Republicans will appreciate,"</i>" and parts of it (e.g. replacing lots of government 'experts' with gordianusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-22950313833705234622021-02-26T00:00:23.935-08:002021-02-26T00:00:23.935-08:00(Cont.)
1. Human-level AI is easy enough to make t...(Cont.)<br />1. Human-level AI is easy enough to make that humans will eventually be able to make it;<br><br />2. Superintelligent (<i>sēnsū lātō</i>: substantially smarter than any human in most ways) general AI based on somewhat similar technology to that human-level AI is physically possible;<br><br />3. That human-level AI can be made by humans in a legible enough way that it will be ablegordianusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-58204955522903945372021-02-25T23:59:22.639-08:002021-02-25T23:59:22.639-08:00(Continued) However, if many of these people are r...(Continued) However, if many of these people are recent apostates from religion looking for confirmation of their atheism and a new communal sense of meaning to explain what's important in life, as an alternative to the conservative religious worldview they had rejected and the elite progressive worldview that was alien to most of them, then organizing the community partly around support for gordianusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-15810498105387106172021-02-25T23:57:51.509-08:002021-02-25T23:57:51.509-08:00As a regular reader of SSC, I found this article f...As a regular reader of SSC, I found this article fair (obviously I'm biased on this, but I don't think either the Metz/Sandifer/SneerClub "Scott's a secret neoreactionary racist luring readers into the far right" narrative [1] or the conspiratorial thinking of many of Scott's more loyal supporters is reasonable) and useful in understanding the situation. I had thought gordianusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-82335664330722446862021-02-25T23:43:34.841-08:002021-02-25T23:43:34.841-08:00Pretty good piece. My only complaint is that you a...Pretty good piece. My only complaint is that you are interpreting "hit piece" too narrowly. <i>Pace</i> Spiers, I don't think many of us thought the NYT regarded Scott as a threat that had to be destroyed. But that doesn't answer the question of whether Metz was writing an article that was deliberately and dishonestly negative. <br /><br />To take one small example, he David Friedmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06543763515095867595noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-88064438429791642822021-02-25T23:30:59.386-08:002021-02-25T23:30:59.386-08:00While I enjoyed the explanation of a hit job vs a ...While I enjoyed the explanation of a hit job vs a lazy job in the general case, it seems clear to me that in this specific case they were working on a piece that was probably going to be milder, stumbled into the anonymity issue, spiked the piece because of the outrage, then brought it back as a hit job after Scott decided to explicitly and voluntarily give up his pseudonym.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-23327706332262797662021-02-25T18:50:15.086-08:002021-02-25T18:50:15.086-08:00This post conforms suspiciously well to my interpr...This post conforms suspiciously well to my interpretations of the whole situation as well, but that quote contrasting the LA Times to The New York Times is just so good.<br /><br />My take on this was that, if The New York Times covered any subculture that I am involved in (death metal, Rationality, CrossFit), I would expect the article to kind of miss the point and inappropriately focus on the Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03367166345541736678noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-30543751644117499822021-02-25T18:45:12.655-08:002021-02-25T18:45:12.655-08:00"Fish will never understand fear of deep wate..."Fish will never understand fear of deep water."<br />Brilliant.<br /><br />Great article Tanner; thanks for sharing.Danielhttp://www.danfrank.canoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-55425481411345135142021-02-25T18:42:16.403-08:002021-02-25T18:42:16.403-08:00To paraphrase Trotsky: you may not be interested i...To paraphrase Trotsky: you may not be interested in the Schmittian friends-and-enemies game, but the Schmittian friends-and-enemies game is interested in you.<br /><br />You are in a culture war whether you like it or not, and one side has no intention of leaving you with any freedom of speech or thought.<br /><br />Scott and the rationalists are now belatedly realizing this and that the media isAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378807093271153119.post-6962606613541457132021-02-25T18:31:27.296-08:002021-02-25T18:31:27.296-08:00Yes, this was a hit piece. Not specifically becau...Yes, this was a hit piece. Not specifically because Scott is that important, but because that's the standard way the modern mainstream press currently interacts with anyone not far left.<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com